Three Hidden Gems from the ASCA National Conference

[00:00:00] Hello there and welcome back to the School for School Counselors Podcast. This is episode seven, "Three Hidden Gems from the ASCA National Conference." You know, I actually started composing this episode in the car, out on those two lane Texas highways headed back toward my home from Austin, Texas and the ASCA national conference. I wanted to compose this that way because I wanted to capture my thoughts for you while they were fresh on my mind so I wouldn't forget the best hidden gems I uncovered during the conference. 

[00:00:37] And I think a few of them will definitely surprise you. So keep listening for that. 

[00:00:44] First of all, if you haven't been to an ASCA conference before, you need to know that it was a- mazing, even when it was 109 degrees outside- it was still amazing. It was so energizing to be in the presence of thousands of school counselors who truly care about their craft, who want to become better practitioners for children, and also build stronger school counseling programs. It was just all around a phenomenal experience. 

[00:01:17] And I would really encourage you, if you haven't already, to be thinking about making plans for next year. You need to do it. I am not going to lie: it is very expensive, but I can tell you firsthand, they make it worth it. 

[00:01:34] It runs very smoothly. There are lots of neat treats and surprises along the way. And it's something that you need to be part of at least once in your career. So go ahead and mark your calendar now to meet me in Atlanta, Georgia next summer: I'll be there. 

[00:01:51] As a matter of fact, our School for School Counselors family that attended this year helped me brainstorm about how we can make next year's experience even better for our folks. So we've got a lot of great ideas that we're super excited to implement. 

[00:02:07] We'll be able to make some super meaningful connections. We'll be able to keep in touch during the conference, and we'll also be able to debrief in a super awesome way so that you don't lose all that amazing knowledge before you get home. 

[00:02:22] So originally I planned to use this episode to give you a recap of my whole ASCA experience, but I think what I'd rather do is give you some insights into the hidden gems that I heard. There were a lot of great sessions, a lot of great presenters. But there were some hidden ideas and some remarks that were made off the cuff that I found particularly relevant to our work. 

[00:02:52] And remember too, that I approach these kinds of conferences through a different lens I certainly go to learn and to network with my peers, because I always want to remain open to learning more and becoming a better practitioner: I don't think any of us can know everything, right? There's always something to be learned from each other, so I'm going to go for the education, hands down. 

[00:03:17] But I'm also listening through the lens of the thousands of school counselors I've had the privilege to interact with in our School for School Counselors Facebook group, our Mastermind and our Get the Job programs, and our "Best Year Ever!", which is coming up by the way- so if you haven't been to our website and signed up for that, that's a free four day event. You're not going to want to miss it. 

[00:03:42] But through all that information, I'm listening through the lens of someone who has heard and perhaps also experienced a lot of the things that you have, those stories that have been entrusted to me. And I think it's really important to listen to the presentation information, to really determine how realistic it is and how relevant it is to real world school counselors in different kinds of situations. 

[00:04:12] And, you know, I can also be a little persnickety. I rarely take information at face value. I am a questioner. I'm always drilling down into things, looking at them from different angles, because I really want all of us to be well-rounded in our knowledge. I think it would be pretty rare that someone can tell me, you know, like, "This is the thing!" and I would blindly accept it and just work that direction. And I know most of you are like that too. 

[00:04:44] With that in mind, I think I've picked up a few things in some of these workshop presentations that most folks may not have recognized. So without further ado, here are my top three hidden gems from the ASCA national conference. 

[00:05:04] Hidden gem number one actually came from the very last session that I attended at the conference on Tuesday, facilitated by two men named Keith Fulthorpe and Aaron Schoenberg. It was titled, "Advanced Applied Solution- Focused Counseling". 

[00:05:23] Learning from these guys was a hoot, y'all! They are a comedy skit in and of themselves. But they're also extremely knowledgeable about solution focused counseling techniques. They really know their stuff. And it was so refreshing to get both sides of that in one workshop, the whole package, the whole experience: being able to enjoy the presentation, but also learn so much. So I want to give a shout out to them just because I so enjoyed being in their presence. 

[00:05:56] It was a kind of workshop where, you know, you're asked to introduce yourself to the person next to you, you know, or turn and share information- and let's be honest, when you're in a workshop and you're asked to do that, you usually are sort of like be grudgingly doing it, right? But in this workshop, I'm telling you: everybody was engaged. We were motivated to practice and to learn. And people very willingly reached out to others that they didn't know. It was exciting, and it was fascinating for me to watch. and I think a large part of that was due to the charisma and the obvious expertise of the presenters. So side note, I'm working really hard to get these guys on the podcast. We talked a little bit about it at the conference, and I think we might be able to make it happen. So keep your ears open for that, because that's going to be a huge treat for all of us. 

[00:06:49] But one of the things that Keith and Aaron mentioned was that often we seek to become practitioners of certain counseling modalities, right? We want to be a solution focused counselor, or we really want to be adept at motivational interviewing, or we want to be awesome at restorative conversations, whatever it is. I'm going to go with solution focused here just because that's what the workshop was centered on. Uh, but the point was made that as you are working through these approaches, you're using them with students, what often happens is the kid throws you a curve ball somewhere. They give you some sort of answer or response that you don't quite know what to do with. And so what often happens is that instead of pausing, taking a moment to regroup, thinking it through, or perhaps even inviting the student to come back again so you can take some time to reflect and regroup, our tendency is just to keep pushing forward. We feel like we have to solve things right now and just keep marching, marching, marching forward. 

[00:08:01] And what often happens is we default back to our area of comfort for whatever feels good to us or what we feel most comfortable with. So for a lot of people, that's going to go back to things like, "Oh, well, you know, we're going to be very person centered" or "very child centered" or whatever it is because it's comfortable and it feels safe to us. 

[00:08:22] Maybe we default back to psychoeducation and coping skills. Maybe we default to, you know, a quick worksheet or something written on paper because it feels safer. But, and here's the bigger issue to the point, we forget to recognize that abruptly changing our approach doesn't necessarily feel safe to STUDENTS- because all of a sudden, the conversation is changing and they have no idea why. We've been going down this specific road and then all of a sudden the student perceives the shift or the change in attitude.

[00:08:59] It's okay to change approaches, right? But be sure that your change in approach is being done intentionally and not just out of fear or bewilderment or a knee jerk reaction. 

[00:09:13] So back to our example, if we flip from that solution focused mindset, while we're working with that student, and, you know, we just start chatting about coping skills or those kinds of things, we're really short changing the student because we're short circuiting the process. And so I really thought that was something interesting to note and a very wise point that was brought to light. 

[00:09:40] Coincidentally, it's also something that I've noticed in our School for School Counselors Mastermind. In the Mastermind, we seek to learn a lot about the different modalities and to really become proficient in one or more approaches. And so we've had some extended studies on motivational interviewing, solution focused counseling, restorative practices: we've got more on the way!

[00:10:05] So, side note- if you're looking for a tribe to geek out with on school counseling, come join us! But one thing that I've noticed as we've studied those is that often people are gung-ho about the first one or two sessions and then we kind of slowly begin to abandon the process. People lose, not really the motivation, but most likely the confidence to continue. And they retreat back to what they know, which I think is so interesting. 

[00:10:39] You know, there's also something to be said for the sheer volume of information that we can access as school counselors and the overwhelming pressure to be amazing practitioners at ALL THE THINGS. Any day of the week, you can log into your social media accounts and find people who claim to be experts at all those things and who make you feel like you ought to be able to be an expert in all of them too. But, number one, they never are. I'm just going to break it to you. 

[00:11:12] There, there is no one who's an expert in everything. And if they tell you they are, that's probably a great clue that they have a lot more to learn. But two, you don't need every tool to be able to be effective with students. All you need are one or two great modalities that you really understand that you've practiced with. Remember, counseling is an art. It's not a set of check boxes to be checked. It's an art. 

[00:11:42] So we are constantly refining, reflecting, and getting better at our craft. And that's okay. You just don't want to become one of those jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none types of counselors. Choose something to invest in. And invest. And I don't mean you have to spend a lot of money on this. I mean, invest your time, invest your interest, invest your energy. Try to avoid retreating into your comfort zone just because you can. 

[00:12:15] If your student marches and one direction, march with them, but don't be afraid to call a timeout. Don't be afraid to step back for a few hours, maybe a day or two and reflect on the best approach, then step back in with that student in that same modality. My friends, there is no shame in the pause. It's important to remember. 

[00:12:45] Hidden gem number two is one that's really going to take a lot of you off guard. But it is a phenomenon that we need to address and one that we really need to start discussing. It, quite frankly, needs to be talked about more and something that I've been railing about for the past year and a half with my Mastermind members. So make sure you're sitting down for this: are you ready? Okay. Again, make sure you're sitting down. 

[00:13:15] Here it is: problem-based small counseling groups in your school are most often counter positive for change as shown by research. Some of your heads just exploded, I know. We are always taught that small groups are the holy grail of school counseling because we are so time limited. We don't have time to meet with every student one-on-one, particularly if you're carrying one of those outrageous case loads. If we have groups of students with similar problems, we've always been taught to group them together. "Just make it happen, get in there, help and make a difference!" Right? So we create the impulse control, the anger management, the anxiety groups, and all the others with the best intentions to try to help. 

[00:14:08] But the problem is these groups are often counter positive for change due to the way they're conceptualized. Let me give you an example. When I reviewed the first page of a search for- here's the quote, this is exactly what I searched- "small group counseling curriculum" on the website, Teachers Pay Teachers because I know, that's where all y'all are going to get your small group curriculums, and then I excluded the listings for bundles or neutral topics: eight out of 14 small group curriculums had problem-based titles. Over half. And the way that most of us are grouping students in schools, isn't working. All right? If the focus is problem-based, you're not going to see the success and the growth that you're hoping for. 

[00:15:06] Instead, and this is coming from an ASCA trainer, we should be focusing on goal work with students. G O. A L goal work. I want to be clear about that because sometimes my twang causes things to get lost in translation. 

[00:15:24] Now I have often argued, and here is a point where a lot of you are going to question your relationship with me, but, but just, just go along for the ride for a minute. 

[00:15:36] So when we look at kids, they're in the school environment with us eight, eight and a half hours a day. They often spend more time with us in school than they spend with their own families at home, right?

[00:15:49] And students are very still ingrained with that egocentric worldview. Studies are showing that people often don't grow out of that worldview until they hit their thirties. So it's all, you know, "Everything happens TO me. It's about me." And with that in mind, the thought pattern for kids is that if they're pulled for a small group, especially if it's problem-based, they assume that everybody knows that they're being pulled for that specific issue: that they're being pulled to address anger management, or they're being pulled to address anxiety, or whatever it is. 

[00:16:33] Why are we pulling them for specific problems and pathologizing them in front of their peers? Particularly when these are the peers they spend most of their waking hours with? And so some of you now are thinking, "Oh, well, no, I don't do that because, you know, nobody knows they're coming to my group. We don't make a big deal out of it. You know, I don't pull them out in front of everybody. We're very discreet." Right?

[00:17:01] Let me break it to you. Kids are very observant. They're very smart. They talk. And even if you haven't labeled a group with one of those cute names, you know, like the Anger Rangers or whatever, they're still going to figure out why they're there. Based on your conversations, the topics presented, or the activities, they're going to know why they've been placed in that group. 

[00:17:27] And then once they understand why they're in that problem-based group, the egocentric thinking kicks in, and they're like, "Oh my gosh, I'm in this anger group, and now all my friends know I'm in an anger group!" And so what's that going to do? Is it going to help them? Probably not. So it's my own inexpert opinion that that's probably a large part of why we sometimes don't see the growth from small counseling groups in schools that we would like to see. 

[00:17:58] So if you're running small groups in schools, I'm definitely not telling you you're wrong- especially since it is a major component of our comprehensive school counseling programs. But what I am challenging you to do is take a more critical eye toward what you're doing. Are you focusing on problem-based groups, or are you sort of mixing things up and working on some goal work with mixed concerns in groups? 

[00:18:32] The third gem that I gleaned from the ASCA conference was not something that we don't know, but it was something that often bears repeating and that I appreciated being reminded of because it's so important. And that's regarding the curriculum that you see out there for school counselors. Particularly if you go to a conference like the ASCA national conference and, you know, everybody has their fancy booths out there with their free bags and their swag and all of that as they're trying to promote these curriculums, we often get dazzled by the packaging of it. We get dazzled by the colors and the slick designs and the nice presentations and the marketing tricks and the perception of what's inside, but we often forget: a lot of these curriculums have very little to absolutely no research based evidence behind them. 

[00:19:35] They might be able to talk about the research that was used in consultative development. But they possess no data on the curriculum's own effectiveness unless it's perception data, which is not super helpful. It's something to be very mindful of. It's easy to be dazzled by shiny colors and slick marketing that seems sparkly and exciting, but that doesn't always mean it's good. 

[00:20:04] And again, this is a rant that my Masterminders have heard from me often, particularly with regard to Teachers Pay Teachers resources. You have to be careful who you buy from there. We often forget it takes a little of nothing to get an account and sign up to sell something, and those people who are selling you things may or may not know what they're talking about. 

[00:20:29] Sometimes you can look up counseling resources and discover they were not even created by a counselor. They were created by someone with an entirely different job and skillset! I have a huge ethical concern about that. And quite frankly, I am shocked that Teachers Pay Teachers has not cracked down on that, but you know, here we are. Anybody that wants to play counselor and create counseling materials can do it. Yikes. 

[00:20:58] You have got to be careful out there. It doesn't mean that you can't experiment with different pieces of things or different approaches to see what works with your student population, but at the same time, guard your expertise because school counseling is becoming very commercial. You are going to have to use the knowledge that you acquired in your graduate program to be a highly discerning consumer, to make sure that you're putting into play your understanding of developmental stages- of how students learn, of what appropriate counseling techniques are for the school setting- and really lean on those as you're evaluating these materials. 

[00:21:46] Be discerning in what you choose to pay attention to and consider what you leave on the shelf. 

[00:21:53] So that was a whirlwind of hidden gems that I heard at the ASCA conference. 

[00:22:00] Some of them have been subject to my interpretation, but I hope at the very least I've given you some food for thought. Some things to really think critically about and consider for your school counseling practice. Again, I'll say counseling is an art. 

[00:22:19] We all support different kinds of students with different kinds of concerns in different kinds of environments. It would be asinine for me to show up and say, you know, you absolutely should or should not do anything in particular. That's what makes our jobs so unique and so important, is that we're able to work with students in their realities, to pick up on the nuances of the situations, and to rely on our training and expertise to select the best approach to helping them toward growth. And that is not anything to be taken lightly. 

[00:23:04] So I feel like I kind of got preachy with this one and I don't EVER want you to feel like I'm preaching to you. 

[00:23:10] I believe in what you do. I think school counselors are amazing. I think you're all amazingly intelligent. But I also just want to kind of put a burr under your saddle and give you some alternative things to think about that aren't so mainstream. That's what keeps us young. That's what keeps us questioning. And that's what's going to drive us toward realizing what's most important for not only our own practice, but for the students we serve. 

[00:23:42] This has been a fun conversation! I hope it has been a little bit challenging for you, but, enjoyable all at the same time. If you enjoy hanging out with us, and you're listening to this podcast close to the date of release- oh my gosh, you need to come join us, for our "Best Year Ever!" series. It's coming up here in just a few days: it's going to be FOUR NIGHTS of amazing free workshops and resources. No cover charge, no registration fee. 

[00:24:11] This is something that we look forward to every year, just as a means of getting to talk to all of you in our School for School Counselors community, to see what things are going on, to help you get ready for your "Best Year Ever!", and we cannot WAIT for you to join us. So hop on over to our website schoolforschoolcounselors.com/bestyearever [all one word]. Get signed up for that, and then it'll give you all the links and all the information about where to show up beginning on July 25th. 

[00:24:44] All right guys, that's all I have for you this week- and I think it was plenty! If you have any questions, feel free to contact me in our Facebook group, School for School Counselors. I would love to have a great conversation and discussion about these things. I think through that, that's how we learn and grow and become better, and I can't wait to learn from you. 

[00:25:06] So, until next week. I hope you have the BEST days ahead and we will see you again soon. Be well, my friends!